For experienced investors , can you lock up your capital in the market to prevent loss?
If you mean hide your assets from court judgments, the answer is no.
Unless you hid your assets a decade or so ago, hiding them is not really an option. The courts see through asset sleight-of-hand disappearances.
NOW---you can put things into a trust, and they can be pretty judgment proof.
But talk to a lawyer who does trusts for the answers upon which you can rely.
Not hiding it from judges , for example you have invest in some sort of foreign currency and you set a target price ?
if you sell it before it goes back down, lol thats why they call it, playing the market. because its a crap shoot.
As Sherlock mentioned, the best you can do is 'play the market,' which involves strategy.
Most "players" understand the concept of 'buying low and selling high.'
However, there are reverse analysts who, for some reason, are able to profit from market loss. I never could fully understand this myself, but if you're going to protect an investment (or series of investments) it may do you well to look at profit-from-loss, investments.
I can't, and neither can my financial advisors apparently. Mutual funds have proven to be a reasonable investment. Single stocks are risky no matter how big the company is, I had a lot of GM stock that was supposed to be bullet proof... ha.
Help me with: I need help.
Weird thing is he told me his money is stuck in the market because he locked his capital to prevvent loss , at the same time he can get his money back once the system is unlock without the need to wait for the market to go back up?
I don't understand any of that to be honest.
Max wrote:
It means no money now or later possibly. Alarm bells...ring!
Please can you give me some more detail? Do you think he can get his capital back.. Eventually??
Sherlock wrote:
Further, the stock market is a roller coaster. If you just try to jump off, you are going to get hurt.You have to be in for the long haul to see real gains.
What about the part where he said he doesn't need to wait for the market to go up but just need to wait for the system to open to unlock the capital? This is the part which I don't understand the most
Anonymous wrote:
Sherlock wrote:
Further, the stock market is a roller coaster. If you just try to jump off, you are going to get hurt.You have to be in for the long haul to see real gains.
What about the part where he said he doesn't need to wait for the market to go up but just need to wait for the system to open to unlock the capital? This is the part which I don't understand the most
Ah--now we are getting to the part that is just plain BS. Sherlock smells a rat!
Sherlock wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
Sherlock wrote:
Further, the stock market is a roller coaster. If you just try to jump off, you are going to get hurt.You have to be in for the long haul to see real gains.
What about the part where he said he doesn't need to wait for the market to go up but just need to wait for the system to open to unlock the capital? This is the part which I don't understand the most
Ah--now we are getting to the part that is just plain BS. Sherlock smells a rat!
In your experience ... what does it "really" mean??? I'm concerned.
Max wrote:
lol..not the first horse out of the gate but you always get to the finish line!
Meaning??
I am by no means an expert (only a few courses & lessons years ago), but I think this, if not some form of trickery (that depends on the person with whom you deal), would be bonds or debentures (possibly dividend).
When you acquire those, you get a percentage of your investment, the interest, every fixed number of months, and in the end of a term (years) the capital. A loan to a company or state, basically. These are as solid as the company behind their issuing - some might pay the interest and default on the capital (ie go bankrupt prior to it).
As for the locking mechanism - price might go up or down (likely latter in your case), depending on how investors view the safety of regaining their capital, discouraging an early sale, but as long as this defaulting doesn't occur, you gain the exact sum of interest + capital for sticking it out.
I think you should get the details, at least on the name(s) and type of investment. Possibly, being kept in the dark is more cause for concern than reality.
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Yͤͭͥ̇eti. wrote:
I am by no means an expert (only a few courses & lessons years ago), but I think this, if not some form of trickery (that depends on the person with whom you deal), would be bonds or debentures (possibly dividend).When you acquire those, you get a percentage of your investment, the interest, every fixed number of months, and in the end of a term (years) the capital. A loan to a company or state, basically. These are as solid as the company behind their issuing - some might pay the interest and default on the capital (ie go bankrupt prior to it).
As for the locking mechanism - price might go up or down (likely latter in your case), depending on how investors view the safety of regaining their capital, discouraging an early sale, but as long as this defaulting doesn't occur, you gain the exact sum of interest + capital for sticking it out.I think you should get the details, at least on the name(s) and type of investment. Possibly, being kept in the dark is more cause for concern than reality.
Hi Yeti , it's some sort of precious metal investment, I wish my friend was more careful before he got involved in it. I do hope it's the lock mechanism like you mentioned as at least it seems that he would get back his original capital.
In that case nay, likely isn't what I mentioned; guess it's the supposition that such commodities have an intrinsic value & limited physical supply, thus always rising in the long term.
These brief articles should provide the gist of it:
https://twocents.lifehacker.com/ask-lifehacker-...
https://www.quora.com/What-are-the-differences-...
https://www.investopedia.com/ask/answers/06/inv...
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@yeti.
He said the gold price is always effected whenever North Korea said something threatening etc , always rising sounds very positive? however his capital is now somehow stuck in the market? I don't really understand ><
It smells like BS to me too. Really the only way I can think of money being stuck in the market is if you invest in a new company and you have to keep the stock for so long, probably not anything to do with gold. If gold goes up every time Kim Jong un says something threatening we would all be buying all we could get.
Help me with: I need help.
DocteurRalph wrote:
It smells like BS to me too. Really the only way I can think of money being stuck in the market is if you invest in a new company and you have to keep the stock for so long, probably not anything to do with gold. If gold goes up every time Kim Jong un says something threatening we would all be buying all we could get.
Thanks DR that's true but what about the lock mechanism that Yeti mentioned? It sounds like exactly what my friend mentioned to me
There are reasons to hold onto stocks or bonds, and certificates of deposit, while either waiting for the price of stocks to go up or for bonds to mature.
But you can always get your money out of these things.
I think someone is playing with you. Don't believe claims of locked up wealth, and do NOT invest in such a scheme.
Sherlock's statement is correct - even at a loss, one may sell bonds at any time if there's a buyer for the price. I don't see a way of interpreting "Locked" as anything more concrete than a figure of speech.
However, let's take a step back from the technicalities.
He's basically speaking a foreign language and you're only picking up every 5th word or so.
With this sort of info loss, guesses may vary in any number of ways, only a few of them related to the whole (and underlying) truth.
I'd say, if it's just his money, you've no obligation to the matter and may simply "frown and nod".
If you're involved (which is a bad idea) or sufficient intrigued, you'd either need to acquire a rather wide background to know which keywords to notice, request a plain explanation (which may or may not be provided), or quote verbatim.
Definitely oughtn't commit to what you don't fully comprehend, if that's the general intention (just so we're clear on that point).
Help me with: [quote]Test.
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Guys , these are the messages from that "expert"... if you don't mind please read it and see what you think of it?
"The capital has been used to sell the gold at target price I can't cancel now.
Only after next month the capital could be restored back after the selling
The balance is now just used for floating and you won't loss do you get it
If you need to cancel the set price you will lose it all now immediately
The only way is to wait until next month and everything would be alright"
Truthfully ... my friend ... is me.
I know I've been stupid. I've prepared for the worst really, but I'm hoping that everything this "expert" told me is true so that I could get my money back next month...
I wish I hadn't been so gullible, I am now just scared.
Hong Kong...
Here is the number one rule about investing in precious metals: don't do it unless you have the metals in your personal possession.
George Takei of Star Trek fame told an audience once that he took a bath by investing in gold.
I have been a fraud investigator and this smells like fraud. Tslk to the anti-fraud unit of the Hong Kong police. I will bet that the guys running this investment scheme are known to the police. Do it today!
Sherlock wrote:
Here is the number one rule about investing in precious metals: don't do it unless you have the metals in your personal possession.George Takei of Star Trek fame told an audience once that he took a bath by investing in gold.
I have been a fraud investigator and this smells like fraud. Tslk to the anti-fraud unit of the Hong Kong police. I will bet that the guys running this investment scheme are known to the police. Do it today!
I already did Sherlock, thank you for your suggestion. I am just hoping that he will do as he promised and I'll get back everything next month... though as I said, I've prepared for the worst.
Now here is something else I learned from conducting fraud investigations--do not get the fraudster charged by the police right away. See an attorney who specializes in fraud cases. Why? Because the police will tip him off that something is coming, and he will likely disappear with your money. A fraud attorney can get a court to freeze his assets, so he cannot abscond with your money.
Here are two anti-fraud law firms to check out in Hong Kong:
http://www.nortonrosefulbright.com/hk/our-servi...
https://www.hg.org/law-firms/fraud/china/hong-k...
Most law firms will give you a free consultation. Make an appointment and see where you stand.
It's the only logical thing to do!
"Once you have eliminated the impossible, whatever remains--however improbable--must be the truth." -- Sherlock Holmes
Oh thank you so much Sherlock! I'm going to talk to them soon.
This case is quite complicated.... here´s the thing, I transfer the sum to a company account, and that company has a mother company which has been around for about 6 years.
So it would seems that this guy actually work for this company? Am I being naive?
As soon as you start spotting these red flags, you have to flip your perspective - assume anything you were told is a lie, and ask yourself what reason is there to trust this entity.
He's not family, he's not a childhood friend, he doesn't reside in the same city (or country), assume he isn't bound by any contract, his hand is in your pocket and he's making obscure threats.
Even if he had been giving perfectly valid sounding explanations, the fact that he lacks any measure of accountability towards you places the risk factor nigh 100%.
The only way to reduce it is by not delaying legal proceedings further.
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Thank you Yeti, I've already emailed 2 firms ... In terms of legal proceedings, what steps will there be?
The law firm will see if the company has been involved with shady dealings.
It sounds like there is actually money laundering going on--transferring funds to hide their point of origin.
If the person who is holding--hopefully not spending--your money is in another country, that can complicate matters.
Do this too: do a Google search. In the search box, type the name of the company with which you have been dealing and follow that name with the word COMPLAINTS. Do another search and substitute the word SCAM for COMPLAINTS. You may find the company has many complaints against it.
Do Google searches og both the companies and the individual with whom you have been dealing.
It is a red flag if the company does not show up in any Google searches.
But see one of those law firms right away. The longer you delay, the less chance of any financial recovery.
Thank you sherlock it's actually public holiday until Tuesday so I might have to wait :( I've emaild them though, I'll definitely call them on Tuesday.
Max wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
Hong Kong...Any ties to Nigeria?
Luckily no , not at all. But apparently there are a lot of gold investment scams in Hong Kong too,
I'm scared, I don't know how I could be so stupid.
Guys I've been reading about target price and stop loss, do you think it could be applicable to my case?
http://www.tradingpicks.com/stop_loss.htm
https://www.quora.com/What-are-target-price-and...
Anonymous wrote:
Guys I've been reading about target price and stop loss, do you think it could be applicable to my case?http://www.tradingpicks.com/stop_loss.htm
https://www.quora.com/What-are-target-price-and...
Anonymous wrote:
Guys I've been reading about target price and stop loss, do you think it could be applicable to my case?http://www.tradingpicks.com/stop_loss.htm
https://www.quora.com/What-are-target-price-and...
Not really--because the guy holding your money does not have a crystal ball and cannot say with any certainty that the price of precious metals is going up.
If you cannot get your money out when you want it, then something is wrong.
Anonymous wrote:
Guys I've been reading about target price and stop loss, do you think it could be applicable to my case?http://www.tradingpicks.com/stop_loss.htm
https://www.quora.com/What-are-target-price-and...
Not in the slightest.
Stop loss is roughly the opposite, leaving a position ahead of any time plans due to a significant drop in price from purchase point, and is self imposed. Its very existence is testament to the uncertainty of investment - if I recall correctly, the best traders don't reach 70% or 80% success in their guesses, and that's a measure for having striked out, tool to keep losses from growing boundlessly (& overall balance positive).
Target price is just one's future selling point, estimation for where it should reach. No guarantee of whether or when it would reach that.
Help me with: [quote]Test.
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And what happens when the target price is not reached?
I'm kind of stuck on this "target price" thing because it's the exact word he used...
The guy with your money has NO IDEA if the price of precious metals will go up or down.
In fact, the precious metals market could plummet--as it has in the past--while your guy is supposedly holding out for a higher price.
You could be waiting a thousand years for the price of precious metals to go up--but your money will be long gone by then.
Yes, you could say you want to hold onto gold or silver until it increases in price--but, again, you have no way of knowing if that will happen.
George Takei was left holding the bag where gold was concerned--he warned everybody not to invest in gold. He lost a lot of money!
Thanks guys I'm definitely going to call the law firm...I'm so scared I hope I'll get everything back somehow...
Sherlock wrote:
Don't let the guy holding your money know that you have concerns. Do everything in secret.Good luck in recouping all of your money!
Thanks ! I'm calling the firm tomorrow!
Max wrote:
Who sets the target price?
Max - the agent/sales , to be honest I didn't even know about it. I didn't sign any contract or agreement.
Max wrote:
But you sent them funds?
Yes... I wasn't thinking properly...
Sherlock wrote:
Don't let the guy holding your money know that you have concerns. Do everything in secret.Good luck in recouping all of your money!
I called one of the firm they asked me to email them, which I already did and received no response.
I'm going to email every firm on the list you gave me, surely someone will response...?
Finally got a respond from one of the firm, they said they will get someone to respond to my request!! I hope this will lead to something good !
Sherlock wrote:
I'm not too hopeful. They sound quite suspicious to me.
Sorry Sherlock , who sounds suspicious?
I got a response from one of the law firm, in fact the only law firm who replied to me...
They did a conflict check and then send me a bill of 6300 USD and said they would proceed after receiving this sum.... I think I need to find another firm...
Well, it depends.
Ask them:
1. Is this a likely case of fraud?
2. What is the likelihood of recovering my assets?
It all depends, really, upon how much money is at stake. I worked on fraud cases as a private investigator. We had a forensic accountant with whom we worked. To do a real asset search costs about $20,000 Canadian. If you had something like $100,000 or more at stake, it was worth it.
The big problem in a fraud case is the fraudster getting wise that you are on to him, and he works like mad to hide his assets. In fact, he may have been hiding them all along.
You have to be able to locate those assets so you can get a court order to freeze them. That way the fraudster doesn't get away with your money.
The law firm wants a retainer up front because of the high costs associated with uncovering a potential fraudster's assets. Of course, that's just the retainer. Your legal costs could go up, up, up from there. Again, it depends upon how much money is at stake.
The other avenue to explore is the police--but you have to know that as soon as a fraudster is contacted by the police, he goes into stealth mode and hides everything he can. But that may be your only practical avenue of approach.
You can also try to find out if other clients have reported bad dealings with this company. You can do a lot of that on your own. You can find out about court cases and investigations through the Internet.
As for as this "investment firm," tell them flat out that you want to pull out. If they refuse, you know that you are dealing with fraudsters. Go to the police if that is your only financially practical option.
Thanks Sherlock for your valuable opinion on this matter! To be honest I think the sum I sent is a large one to me personality but definitely not worthwhile enough for a lengthy legal battle... at the same time 6300 USD was an hourly rate so how many hour will they have to spend on it? We don't know.
Sherlock I wonder if there's a way for me to private message you? I would like to tell you the whole story with screencaps and stuff, (of course I want to tell everyone too but I think at the moment it's not something I can publicly share with everyone) , I just want to know your opinion on the whole thing , maybe when you see the whole story you can see a completely new direction?
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